Dear All,<div><br></div><div>Please see comments below regarding the Roundtable next week. Steve proposes some interesting topics we could cover as part of the discussion. If anyone else has input please let me know.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Derek</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: <b class="gmail_sendername">Steve Katz NOAA Fedoral</b> <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:steve.katz@noaa.gov">steve.katz@noaa.gov</a>></span><br>
Date: Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 2:26 PM<br>Subject: Re: [Roundtable] Material for Jan 11th Roundtable<br>To: Derek Gray <<a href="mailto:gray@nceas.ucsb.edu">gray@nceas.ucsb.edu</a>><br><br><br>
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Hi Derek<br>
<br>
I am sending this to you because I don't know the protocol for
"outsiders" to interlope into the process of this discussion group.
But if this is worth widening, feel free to forward.<br>
<br>
I am wondering if it is possible to alter the discussion somewhat -
the question of professional science activity and credibility vs.
advocacy has been the topic of a couple recent discussions at NCEAS
and I am not sure something so open ended is likely to pay the
biggest dividends. For example, much of the prior discussions have
devolved into discussions of purity of research enterprise vs.
pragmatic reality - and if we are all going to acknowledge that the
science we really do is not strictly "pure" then there is no useful
line between science and advocacy. Also we have discussed the
nature of individual decision making and how do we identify the
individual separate from what we do - at work I am a scientist, but
when I am home after work I can say anything I damn well please and
its on all y'all to tell the difference. Overarching all of these
discussions is the fact that if there is a line somewhere it is
colored to great degree by values - personal and professional. And
it is really slippery to have an open ended discussion about values
without each persons values influencing their position and how they
express it. I am not sure that in total these discussions have been
entirely as productive as they might have been.<br>
<br>
So I am wondering if it would be better to focus on some more narrow
proposition? I suspect the selection of a title might be a place
for some democracy - but to offer more than a complaint, there are
some possibilities:<br>
<br>
When a scientific finding is distasteful or inconvenient to a given
political entity it is often identified as nothing more than a
political position independent of the objective support for the
position (e.g. global warming is a lefty scheme). What
responsibilities accrue to individual professional scientists who
might have engaged in climate research? Any? None?<br>
<br>
On what basis do professional scientists claim their information is
any different from corporate, religious, legislative, or legal
sources? Should all this information be treated as equal and
"trade-able" and if not is there a basis for discrimination? And
does this basis define a set of criteria for distinguishing personal
opinion from objective science? Is there a difference between a
"denier" and a hypothesis tester?<br>
<br>
If the community at large does not distinguish between science
information and any other stakeholder position is that a problem?
and does that de facto make the whole discussion of advocacy moot?
If the users of the information cant tell the difference then there
is no difference, no matter what we like to tell ourselves when we
are alone and cold in the dark. <br>
<br>
Let me know what you think or if you want to include the rest of the
folks in the conversation.<br>
Thanks<br>
SLK<br>
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On 1/2/2013 12:23 PM, Derek Gray wrote:
<blockquote type="cite">Dear All,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Next week I will be holding a discussion on the involvement
of ecologists in advocacy. I have no expertise in this area
whatsoever, but I think it is an interesting topic that most
scientists grapple with at some point in their career. I thought
we could discuss a couple recent papers and a media story
(attached). Please feel free to suggest any relevant papers that
the group might want to have a look at before meeting.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thanks!</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Derek<br clear="all">
<div><br>
</div>
-- <br>
<div><span style="text-align:left;font-size:13px;font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">Derek
Gray</span></div>
<div><span style="text-align:left;font-size:13px;font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">Postdoctoral
Fellow</span></div>
<div><span style="text-align:left;font-size:13px;font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">National
Center for Ecological Analysis and Synthesis</span></div>
<div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">University of California Santa Barbara</font></div>
<div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">phone: <a href="tel:805-892-2512" value="+18058922512" target="_blank">805-892-2512</a></font></div>
<div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica,
sans-serif">email: <a href="mailto:gray@nceas.ucsb.edu" target="_blank">gray@nceas.ucsb.edu</a></font></div>
<div style="text-align:left">website: <a href="http://www.nceas.ucsb.edu/%7Egray/" target="_blank">http://www.nceas.ucsb.edu/~gray/</a></div>
</div>
<br>
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<br>
</div>
</div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:13px;text-align:left">Derek Gray</span></div><div><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:13px;text-align:left">Postdoctoral Fellow</span></div>
<div><span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,255);font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:13px;text-align:left">National Center for Ecological Analysis and Synthesis</span></div><div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">University of California Santa Barbara</font></div>
<div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">phone: 805-892-2512</font></div><div style="text-align:left"><font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">email: <a href="mailto:gray@nceas.ucsb.edu" target="_blank">gray@nceas.ucsb.edu</a></font></div>
<div style="text-align:left">website: <a href="http://www.nceas.ucsb.edu/~gray/" target="_blank">http://www.nceas.ucsb.edu/~gray/</a></div>
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